Have Remington Rand Serial Numbers

By Robert Gibson. * Colt * Ithaca * Remington-Rand * Union Switch & Signal. A serial number preceded by an 'S' indicates an M1911A1.

I picked up a shooter grade 1911A1 off of Gunbroker for what I think is a decent price; it'll fill the hole in my collection until a better one comes along. It was sold as a Remington Rand, and the slide is marked that way, but the gun has been reblued, and most of the markings are gone (I'll probably send it off to Shuff's for a park job). I'm hoping that some of the experts will confirm that the frame is Remington Rand as well, or at least USGI. The only markings I could find are the serial number and a small '7' near the trigger guard, where it meets the grip.

Any opinions would be welcome. If it's genuine USGI, I feel like it was a good deal ($500). If it's an aftermarket or commercial frame, I'm going to bring it up with the seller, but $500 for a 1911A1 isn't all that bad, I don't think.it fits together pretty well, and doesn't look too bad (although it'll look better with a more 'genuine' finish). You bought a ' reweld ' 1911. Just like Garands people rewelded demilled 1911 frame halfs together, frames were cut/sheared at slide stop. The reblue discoloration, goofy slide stop hole and poor clean up maching on the frame rails is a dead give away. I would recommend getting your $500 back.

Yep, my concern also. As a buyer, what did you think was going on in this picture (below).

You can take heart in the fact that the slide (even heavily buffed and blued) is worth 100 bucks. The grips and small parts are worth another 50-100. If the barrel is WW2 GI and in nice shape, it's worth another 100. Since shipping it back is gonna cost you 50 anyway (assuming the seller agrees), 100 bucks as a lesson learned isn't too bad (believe me, I have been rooked for far more than this! As BRUTUS, lite-box, zippysrifle, and HughUno have pointed out, the frame has been monkeyed with and probably re-serial numbered after it was reconstructed.

All manufacturers underlined the 'o' in 'No' Colt Ithaca Remington Rand used No from beginning of production at 916405. At 955000 they started using 'NO' as well as 'No' and they used only 'NO' after 1016000. This pistol has a serial number below 955000 but it has the later style 'NO'. That isn't a combination that was originally used. The shape of the 'O' is different too, closer to '0'. Compare to the picture above. All Remington Rands should have 'UNITED STATES PROPERTY' above the serial number.

Definitely a welded frame. I sold a ton of these back in the late 60's. You can see a few very slight signs of metal missing and uneven surfaces in a couple of pics, plus the coloration differences which are pretty sure signs of a welded frame. However, if you bought it for a shooter until you can fine a nicer example, it should work fine. I've owned several welded guns and if done right, they make excellent shooters. But as noted, it has no real added 'collector' value.

If you want a nice gun, take a look at the new Remington Talo 1911A1 models. Very well made, accurate, and made by Remington. They completely interchange with military model parts. I have two and I really like them. Definitely a welded frame. I sold a ton of these back in the late 60's. You can see a few very slight signs of metal missing and uneven surfaces in a couple of pics, plus the coloration differences which are pretty sure signs of a welded frame.

However, if you bought it for a shooter until you can fine a nicer example, it should work fine. I've owned several welded guns and if done right, they make excellent shooters. But as noted, it has no real added 'collector' value. If you want a nice gun, take a look at the new Remington Talo 1911A1 models. Very well made, accurate, and made by Remington. They completely interchange with military model parts.

I have two and I really like them. Thanks for all the feedback. I was just beginning my research into USGI 1911s when a couple deals popped up on GB. For $500, this one seemed too good to pass up, even though it was obviously refinished and the markings were removed from the frame. I figured it was an inexpensive first foray into 1911s, and even with no collector value to speak of, not a bad deal. After hearing it's a rewelded frame, I was going to contact the seller about a refund. However, if the gun is safe to shoot, I'm back to where I started, with a $500 non-collectable 'shooter' that served in WW2.more or less what I was looking for in the first place.

I can't imagine a rewelded pistol is as serious a risk to shoot as a rewelded Garand, the pressures involved are much lower, and the area where it was welded doesn't seem prone to catastrophic failure; if it's survived since the '60s, it'll probably survive the few boxes of ammo that I'll put through it if I hang onto it. I've got plenty of handguns, even 1911s, but nothing that was actually USGI. This is my first, and while it's not a pristine example, I'm gonna give it another day of consideration before deciding to keep it or ask the seller for a refund.

Either way, I'll keep learning what I can (damn, the 1911 books are expensive, haha) and keep my eye open for a better gun to represent the 1911A1. I should get my other attempt at a cheap, entry level 1911 this week. It's a Colt 1911, and even though the slide appears to be incorrect for the frame (I think the 'Rampant Colt' should be behind the slide serrations), it was another one that seemed too good to pass up. I get some of the best deals on the internet working midnights.the stuff that gets listed at 4AM on a Tuesday doesn't get snatched up immediately by someone else. The downside is, there's a bit more risk when you don't ask questions before you bid! FWIW, this is the original listing for this gun. The discoloration can be seen in the photos, but I figured it was either bad lighting or a bad cold blue touch up: And here's the other one I won, a Colt 1911 from WW1.any feedback on this one?: And since we're on the subject, gotta show off my IHC receiver; another 4AM BG special, $425 for a Grade A receiver with CMP paperwork: http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=287938441.

FWIW, this is the original listing for this gun. The discoloration can be seen in the photos, but I figured it was either bad lighting or a bad cold blue touch up: And here's the other one I won, a Colt 1911 from WW1.any feedback on this one?: Everyone loves a bargain or a good deal. But when you add up the cost for those two pistols ($500 + $799 + shipping) you spent ~$1350. You also mentioned possibly spending even more money to have the welded pistol refinished. In that price range you can find a righteous original USGI M1911A1 that has no issues. Maybe not on Gunbroker.com but they are around.

I got this Ithaca in January of this year at a local gun store for $1200. Tomorrow morning I'm going to get up early and drive for almost an hour to a gun show out in the country that has had many interesting items when I have gone there before. I got this Steyr M95 carbine with a nice tiger-striped stock there and also a hard-to-find bayonet for an Argentine Mauser carbine.

2002 Download It Microsoft Picture Manager 2007 Portable Oxygen. I'll stop at a pawn shop that is on the way to the gun show where on past trips I found a M1903 Mark I with sling and USMC stippled buttplate and a Belgian pre-World War II FN Hi Power pistol. The point is that by putting in some effort you can find cool stuff and good deals out there. It isn't as convenient as buying on the Internet - I do that too - but you can find deals you won't see on the Internet. Always buy the best quality that you can afford. For the same amount of money, it is better to have one righteous piece than two items with issues.;) Regarding your Colt M1911, the pictures are too poor to tell much. If it is correct and only needs a refinish it might be worth sending it to a place that will refinish it properly http://www.turnbullmfg.com/store.asp?pid=20445. You bought a ' reweld ' 1911.

Just like Garands people rewelded demilled 1911 frame halfs together, frames were cut/sheared at slide stop. The reblue discoloration,missing markings, goofy slide stop hole and poor clean up maching on the frame rails is a dead give away. I would recommend getting your $500 back. This answers my first observation - the fonts in 'Remington' and 'Rand' DON'T match nOPe.

And 'SYRACUSE', and NY USA don't match fonts either!!! Also; still contact the seller, and ask for partial refund. EVEN tho' none of his wording could be mis-representation by any construction. If guns are like planes, EVERY past owner is in the liability loop (if he really didn't know it was fabbed hardware).

Now that I look at my GB acct page, I recognize the listing. I had it on my watch list, and you sure can't see the mis-matched fonts in snappic 4 as in yours. Milsurp - you should post a few more snappics of your own hardware. This answers my first observation - the fonts in 'Remington' and 'Rand' DON'T match nOPe. And 'SYRACUSE', and NY USA don't match fonts either!!! I think the slide marking is authentic.

The differences you might be seeing are due to the effects of buffing the slide before it was blued causing softening of the markings. They are the third type of Remington Rand slide markings, like this: http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j473/dpd3672/IMG_20132.jpg. Ok, I did a complete detail strip on the gun today, and took some better pictures (DSLR, rather than the crappy cell phone shots posted in the OP). I have my doubts that this gun was rewelded. While I'm not an expert on welding, machining, or even 1911s (hell, I'm constantly humbled by the experts on Garands and Carbines, and that's probably my strongest area, but I digress), what I'm seeing is not consistent with what's been mentioned previously in this thread. As suggested before, I think this is a Colt 1911A1 frame with a Remington Rand slide. It's obviously been reblued, and somewhere along the line the US Property and 1911A1 markings were removed, as seems to be the case with a lot of these guns.

I don't think it was welded together from 2 demilled pieces, I think it was just refinished very badly, probably by a DIY'er with some cold blue and bad preparation. So here's why I think this is the case: My understanding of why the colors are so different is due to the heat generated by the welding affecting the metal, much like the lead dipped heels of Garands. If this is the case, it seems to me that the line, where the two finishes meet, would not be so abrupt. On this gun, it looks like someone painted on the finish with a brush or Q-tip, there are even spots where it looks like it was 'gobbed on' thick. I think 'Bubba' ground off the US Property marks, then tried to refinish the gun, very poorly.

Here's a better look at the left side of the gun, notice how thick the finish is along the top of the frame, around the recoil spring and near the 'idiot scratch': If the heat from welding is what caused the discoloration, I can't see how a little 'island' of the darker blue would have survived the process. Here there's a dark blue spot in the middle of the plum colored refinish job: The frame rails also don't look messed with, and the machining marks in the groove are consistent in both areas: http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j473/dpd3672/1911%20IHC/DSC_0009.jpg. I also don't see any welding slag, seams, or machining marks inside the frame, and the color inside the frame, around the recoil spring, is the same as the darker part of the gun.the plum color is only on the outside of the frame, not the inside.

The metal around the recoil spring is very thin, though, like a lot was ground off when the markings were removed: I'm pretty certain the slide hasn't been messed with, other than the bluing: So what do you think, am I wrong here, or missing something? I'm leaning toward a Colt Frame/RR Slide with a commercial bluing job, then a very bad rebluing job done in someone's garage.

I don't think it was welded up, but please let me know if you think I'm wrong. As suggested before, I think this is a Colt 1911A1 frame with a Remington Rand slide. I'm leaning toward a Colt Frame/RR Slide If it's a Colt frame, why isn't the 'o' in 'No.'

I think you're missing the bigger picture. You know that texturing on the front of the grip isn't USGI, right? That texturing is wrong, the USGI markings on the frame have been removed, the frame has possibly been re-serial numbered. Even if you spend more money refinishing it, what will you have? It will never look 'right'.

It will be no more authentic than the non-USGI 1911s you already have. It will never have any more collector value or shoot any better than the other 1911's you already have. The value of USGI 1911's and 1911A1's is as historical and collector pieces.

As shooters, they have no advantage over a modern 1911. In fact, they are inferior as shooters to modern 1911's that have the benefits of the last 65 years of development. You can have collector piece 1911's and shooter 1911's. A 'shooter collector piece 1911' is an oxymoron. If you want a collector piece USGI, get that.

If you want a good shooter, get a modern 1911. That pistol is neither.

It falls between two stools (No matter what you do, that pistol will never be a collector piece, and it has no advantages as a shooter over the 1911's you already have or might buy. I really think the best course is to try and get your money back and then use that money to do a proper refinish of your other new purchase, assuming it doesn't have other issues besides the lack of finish. I'm not trying to be mean, I just hate to see you waste your time, attention, and money on a dead end.:).

Frequently Asked Questions This page responds to the following frequently-asked questions: • • • • • • • • • • • • • If your question isn't answered here, you may me, Richard Polt. Typewriter ribbons are still being made and are not too hard to find. Almost all manual typewriters use half-inch-wide ribbons, and most typewriters can use dual-color ribbons (such as red and black), so look for one of those -- they look nice and can be useful. Good ribbons are available from the sources listed below. Your local office supply store may also have ribbons for manual typewriters (ribbons intended for printing calculators may also work, but they tend to be inked too heavily). Ribbon spools (the reels) are slightly more challenging, if your typewriter is missing them.

Ribbons are usually sold on plastic spools, and you may have to experiment with a few kinds before you find one that fits your particular machine. Some typewriters use eyelets on either end of the ribbon, which automatically reverse the ribbon; the same effect can usually be produced by tying a knot near the end of the ribbon. PS: never throw away an old metal spool -- rewind a new ribbon onto it! Baco Ribbons makes ribbons in many sizes, colors, and materials.

Contact Charlene Oesch, Baco Ribbon & Supply Co., 1521 Carman Road, Ballwin, MO 63021, 314-835-9300, fax 636-394-5475, e-mail. Other US manufacturers are in Ennis, TX and in Santa Fe Springs, CA.

Tony Casillo of TTS Business Products in Garden City, NY, carries many varieties of ribbon and can advise you on the correct spool, ribbon material, etc. Call 516-489-8300 or e-mail. Jay Respler of Advanced Business Machines Co. In New Jersey carries ribbons for virtually all typewriters: Phone 732-431-1464 after 11 AM Eastern, or e-mail. 'I offer nylon, cotton, silk, and all colors. I can get many odd sizes.

I stock newer cartridges as well as older spools. I supply pictures of spools to help determine what the customer needs. We ship anywhere in the world.'

Earl De Barth, of, telephone number 215-855-6851, 9:00 am to 4:00 pm ET, e-mail, has the material for the 25 mm and wider ribbons. He has no spools, so requests that the purchaser send him a spool on which to wind the 'new' ribbon. He can sometimes provide ribbons in colors other than black or black/red. Prices vary according to length, number of ribbons purchased, etc. Other sources include,, and. In the UK, try,,, or (on eBay). In Germany, try.

Often, a problem with a manual typewriter can be fixed at home with a little time, a little ingenuity, and some simple tools such as a screwdriver. For a few tips on mechanical repairs and restoration, see. For Will Davis's more extensive advice, see his. But sometimes an expert's personal help is certainly needed. I cannot give you any expert advice, but I have a list of around the world that will work on manual typewriters.

Chapter 4 of provides tips on fixing many common problems. It may take time to find it, and you may need a flashlight.

You may need to move the carriage all the way to the left or right and look at the area revealed (especially on Royals); lift up the ribbon cover and peer at the inner frame of the machine (especially on Smith-Corona portables and '50s Remington portables); look in a corner of the slotted panel behind the keyboard (earlier Remington portables); or look at the bottom of the typewriter. Once you have found the serial number you can try looking up its date at, a site that lists serial numbers for many makes. If you can find your typewriter's serial number, it may be listed at (select your manufacturer from the drop-down menu). Failing that, here are some rules of thumb: Weird? If your typewriter looks bizarre in some way (strange keyboard, shape, etc.), chances are that it's pre-1920., and I'll try to give you more information. Have an Underwood? If it says 'Wagner Typewriter Co.'

On the back, it dates from 1895-1900. If it doesn't say 'Wagner' but has an open frame (you can easily see the works), it dates from 1900-1930. If it's an open-framed Underwood #5, check my for a list of serial numbers that will let you date it with precision. (Look for the serial number on the right top of the frame, under the right end of the carriage.) If it is an office-sized typewriter with an enclosed frame (covered in sheet metal), it's after 1930.

Underwood portables with three rows of keys date from 1919-29. Those with four rows of keys are mostly from the thirties and forties. Have a Remington portable? Check my for a list of pre-war Remington portables, with the dates of each model. If it's not on my list, it dates from after World War II. Patent dates can tell you that a typewriter was made after a certain date, but sometimes the machine was made quite a few years after the latest patent date.

In the case of older (open-frame) Underwoods, the company got so many patents that the last patent date is probably very close to the year of manufacture. (Look on the back of the machine for a big decal listing all the patents.) If your typewriter has very little plastic, it's probably no later than the mid-1930s. If it's painted in crinkle paint (with tiny wrinkles), it's usually from the late thirties or the forties. Black Economy India Arun Kumar Pdf To Word. Postwar typewriters (that's World War II we're talking about) can be recognized by various signs: U.S. Patent numbers above 2,400,000; extensive use of plastic; and keys that are not circular, but are rounded-off rectangles. IBM Selectrics date from 1960 at the earliest. This also goes for other modern electric machines that use a single type element (such as the Selectric 'golf ball').

Electronic typewriters with a daisy wheel date from the 1970s at the earliest. The monetary value of a typewriter can't be determined precisely, because there are relatively few collectors and the market is always changing. Furthermore, the condition of a typewriter affects its value significantly.

To further complicate things, there are literally hundreds of makes of typewriter that are of value to a collector, ranging from $50 machines to $50,000 machines. I won't list them all here -- with the details of your typewriter (make, model, condition). However, you should first check to see whether your typewriter falls into one of the classes below, as 95% of them do. I also recommend searching completed auctions at, where you will find many examples of the common makes of typewriter. Postwar typewriters Few large typewriters made after World War II are considered 'collectible,' because they are mostly look-alikes produced in great quantities -- and they are often ugly, in many people's view.

Don't expect the price to go over $50 or so. The exceptions to this rule are typewriters that have a strange or specialized mechanism -- for instance, the Varityper, a 'cold typesetting' machine descended from the Hammond which prints from a type shuttle. Postwar portables have become popular since around 2000 as collectibles and working typewriters. Value largely depends on appearance; bright colors bring a premium. The more eye-catching and colorful '50s portables can bring $200 or more, depending on condition and luck.

Common makes in dull colors will probably be worth under $50. As for prewar typewriters, most belong to the following makes: Corona This is one of the first portables.

The Corona that most collectors like is the model 3, with three banks of keys and a carriage that folds down onto the keyboard. This is a beginner's machine that is frequently found. An informed collector will hold out for one in excellent condition, and will not pay much more than $50 for it. Colored specimens are worth more than black ones.

Oliver These machines are collectible and are certainly unusual to the modern eye, with their U-shaped typebars hovering over the platen. However, most are not rare. Expect the value to be in the $50-$200 range, give or take some according to condition. Olivers do have many minor variations, some of which are unusual.

The most valuable Oliver is the #1, which can be recognized by its nickel finish and the fact that the tabs sticking out of its sides are flat to the ground. Remington Remington was always a leader in the typewriter industry -- so many Remington machines are common and worth little. Understroke Remingtons (which type on the underside of the platen) are worth some money; these are full-sized, office typewriters with model numbers under 10. The most common understroke Remingtons are the #6 and #7, worth around $100; other understroke models can be worth more.

There are also many models of; most of these are frequently found, but are enjoyed by some collectors. They will bring a modest price, say $30, give or take according to condition and luck. As usual, bright colors bring a premium.

The rare Remington Electric of 1925 is worth several hundred dollars; this is a boxy machine that has a carriage return lever on the right. Royal Royals #1, #5, and Standard are office machines with an unusual, low profile and a keyboard that looks like it's emerging from a staircase (collectors call these the 'flatbed' models). They are worth around $50-$200 depending on condition (usually they are in poor shape).

Many older Royal office typewriters are model 10 (usually not marked as such); the earlier ones have glass windows on the sides. Value depends on condition -- anywhere from zero to $200. Royal portables are fun, but not worth much (about $10-$200 depending on condition, color, and luck, with an average value around $40). The big exception is the gold-plated version of the '50s Royal Quiet Deluxe portable, which is worth $400+.

Finally, if your machine says 'Royal Grand,' you have found a very rare item that's the most valuable model of this make. Smith These are common, conventional typewriters.

The earlier L.C. Smiths have a handsome decal with prancing horses. If you have such a machine in excellent condition, the lower the model number the better, it can bring $100+ on a good day.

Smith merged with Corona to create Smith-Corona in 1926. Smith-Corona portables from the 30s, in excellent condition, can be nice and might be worth $50 or so.

Later Smith-Coronas are so common that they are of minor interest to collectors (although they are fine writing machines). Olympia A very successful German make, with a reputation for high quality. It is unlikely that an Olympia will bring more than $50, but a particularly beautiful specimen may go higher. Underwood The earliest Underwoods are considered collectible and will bring roughly $200; these usually say 'Wagner Typewriter Co.' Some collectors or people who want one old typewriter will enjoy an ordinary Underwood (which is likely to be a #5) if it's in great condition. Very nice #5's can bring $200 or so, but the average-condition Underwood (any model) is worth little.

There are some attractive Underwood portables, particularly the 'Underwood Standard Portable Typewriter' of 1919-29, with three rows of keys (the name is bigger than the typewriter). It's worth about $50. For more about Underwoods,. Woodstock These well-made but conventional typewriters are generally ignored by collectors.

The Woodstock Electrite is an early electric typewriter that is not frequently found, but still may bring under $100. A particularly nice Woodstock with great decals can sometimes get up to $200. Chapter 3 of provides detailed advice on selecting a writing machine. Here are some quick tips. It's partly a matter of taste, but some makes have gathered a lot of fans for their sturdiness, their looks, or their feel. Many users prefer a machine that uses 'segment shift' (also known as 'basket shift') rather than 'carriage shift': in other words, when you shift, the carriage does not move up and down but the typebars do.

This is easier, particularly for those used to computer keyboards. Size is another consideration: a standard office machine is very heavy, but offers the greatest mechanical sophistication. If you choose an ultra-flat, 'laptop' typewriter, the portability will usually come at the cost of a less satisfying feel. For many users, a mid-sized portable made between 1930 and 1970 will do the trick. A few manual portables are still made in China today, but their quality is not great. Here are some possibilities.

My list below is linked to current eBay auctions. Be patient and hold out for a machine in good condition, offered by a seller with a good reputation. For a professionally cleaned and reconditioned typewriter from sources other than eBay, I also recommend (mostly pre-1940 machines), (mostly postwar machines), and. • with segment shift: this well-engineered American design was made for about 50 years in various body styles, with minor mechanical changes.

The traditional model names are Standard, Silent, and Sterling. For beauty, look for the glossy 1930s versions, which are sometimes boxy in design, sometimes streamlined. For maximum sturdiness, look for the 1950s versions, typically finished in colored wrinkle paint. For the most features (such as power spacing and interchangeable type), look for 1960s-70s versions (the name Galaxie was introduced at this time). •: excellent German engineering made this company great.

The portables and office machines are both good. The postwar SG (big) and SM (medium) series are traditional favorites of writers. SM 3 through SM 7 are carriage-shifted; SM 8 and SM 9 are basket-shifted and easier on the pinkies. •: a lot of writers swear by their Swiss engineering. The Hermes 3000 is the most popular model. The '60s version of this machine, in green paint with an angular body, is probably the smoothest and best made. •: my personal favorite is the model 7 with glossy black paint.

There are also other variants. These are relatively quiet, comfortable 1930s machines with Deco looks. There are differences of opinion about the distinctive feel of this design, which brings the typebar just far enough to 'kiss' the platen instead of delivering a loud smack.

•: look for pretty ones from the 1920s and 1930s, with shiny paint -- or the postwar Quiet De Luxe model, with a basket shift. •: prewar ones are good; quality declined after the war, although the styling was interesting. •: if you want an office (non-portable) machine, you may enjoy this classic.

Underwoods have a satisfying clickety-snap. In top condition (which you should insist on) they can sometimes get expensive (up to $150 or so). •: another classic office workhorse of the first half of the twentieth century. In the 1930s this model converted to basket shift.

•: a well-made office machine that always featured basket shift. Please see my page on. Are the Bush documents fakes? In a word: yes. From a typewriter. Specifically, my beloved. I typed the text, then scanned it.

This method will always be more convincing than using a simulated typewriter font for computers. However, I have created a number of typewriter fonts that you are welcome to. Many more free typewriter fonts are available. Hey, some of us like it!

But we're perverse. See (the end of the first section) for tips on this problem. Most manual typewriters did without the numeral 1; you were expected to type a lowercase L instead. Often for a zero you would type an uppercase letter O; for an exclamation mark, you would type period-backspace-apostrophe, or hold down the shift key and spacebar while typing the period and apostrophe (usually you can superimpose characters if you hold down the spacebar). Cyrillic typewriters (for Russian, Ukrainian, etc.) do have a numeral 1, but don't have a numeral 3, because the Cyrillic equivalent to Z looks like a 3!

All are ways to save a few parts and make manufacture cheaper. Why take a country road when you can take the Interstate? Why ride a bike when you can drive a car? Why shop at the corner store when you can shop at Wal-Mart? Why cook from scratch when you can eat fast food? Why draw a picture of something when you can point your smartphone at it? Efficiency isn't always the most important consideration.

Typewriters are durable, personal, private, single-purpose, independent, and secure. Of course, they are also efficient tools for typing envelopes, labels, forms, checks, and other odd jobs. For more thoughts on this topic from writers who type, see. And for a full-blown typist's manifesto, check out my book,.